Haven't forgotten about this -- will do this tonight (for real though this time).

-NRH

I bought a shirt!

No further objection having been heard, on behalf of the Dean I am approving these arms.

Quote from: Ián S.G. Txaglh on April 13, 2022, 11:40:00 AM
btw, how do you like the following books (by frank h.)? i see a peak in god emperor of dune, the idea of the golden path is simply super cool. i have to admit, that books by the son are far worse imho. i was able to go through the first trilogy, prelude to dune, as they say today "not great, not terrible" (poor dyatlov, could have never thought to become a meme-maker for westerners), but i was so angry and frustrated reading the first book of butlerian jihad, that i resigned and do not have guts to continue.

The sequels are all pretty poor, with the son's books even worse.  I think that Dune used up most of Herbert's big ideas, and because it ended with a prescient messiah-figure coming into ultimate power, it's hard to realistically provide challenges.  Part of what makes Dune fun is that it has very clear conceptions of good and evil, and the good guys struggle against enormous odds but succeed because of their virtue and their skill.  In the sequels, they have to kind of invent new challenges for people who already are at the top, and it's a different sort of story that doesn't work as well.

The son's books are, frankly, just standard-issue scifi that doesn't have any of the depth of thought or consideration of the original.

Quote from: Ián S.G. Txaglh on April 13, 2022, 05:48:00 AM
ok, yes, fremen were excited up to the level they waged the total war (jihad) in a name of their prophet, paul muad'dib. they were from the desert. they weren't brown-skinned, as herbert was not talking about the colour of skin at all (afaik and from what i found in commentaries). honestly, i did not see there a particular muslim stereotype, rather a religious fanaticism stereotype (jihading, crusading, pogroming...). all the arabic (and not necessarily muslim) connotations to fremen are stereotypical, as it is the closest to any desert civilisation ordinary westerners can imagine. but even using arabic, herbert used concepts from different religions, like in the case of shai-hulúd, grandfather of the desert, with hidden meaning "thing of immortality", high proly from some far eastern religion.

It is a sci-fi book, it's true, and so it's not literally a white Christian saving brown Muslims.  But we might not be able to come to an agreement if you can't imagine that the Arabic-speaking Quran-quoting desert-dwelling pseudo-Sunni jihadis were largely intended to represent our world's Muslims.  I mean, really everyone is mostly Muslim, but the Fremen are very obviously an allegory for a certain current stereotype.

Either way, I don't think that specifically is the problem.  It's probably good that an author isn't just doing another pseudo-Rome in the future, but instead representing the possible future of other cultures (like Firefly's Chinese).  It's just problematic when combined with the white/foreign/aristocratic savior narrative, and the recent film was significantly more problematic in the same way.

We can certainly agree that it's a great book, at least :)

After consulting with my party leader as well as the last person to hold the office, I accept the nomination.

Sure, all the details are more complicated than just "white guy saves the brown folks," but the overarching pattern is clear.

To take your example of the religions being syncretic, okay: the Zensunni are simultaneously representative of the Jews, Muslim tradition, and Zen Buddhists.  They don't really talk about it much, except to say that they were wanderers who fled from repeated pogroms and their religion came from Sunni Islam and Zen Buddhism.  But, I mean, come on... the brown-skinned desert nomads who are going to go on a religious jihad (it's even literally labeled a "jihad")?  It's very clearly a pastiche of Muslim stereotype.

Quote from: Dr. Txec Róibeard dal Nordselvă, Esq., O.SPM, SMM on April 12, 2022, 08:30:46 AM

Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on April 12, 2022, 08:13:48 AM
They also help advise the Chancery and can fire the Secretary of State

I'm hoping this isn't a portent of things to come...

I think you're doing a good job.

Quote from: Ián S.G. Txaglh on April 12, 2022, 02:56:16 AM
as for the dune "white aristocrat saves dark-skinned population", i've never read it there. for me, it is a story about the future of mankind, the formation of golden path, i paid not much attention to paul's aristocratic origin and colonial connotations of his relations to fremen. the story has its setup, it is not black and white, the auctorial inspirations in the real world are clear, and human society is based on stereotypes whether we like it or not. i have difficulties reading SF literary, cos these are modern myths, of course with cultural stereotypes, innovated by the auctorial imagination, but still metaphors and stories. if we treat thoroughly literature through a modern social paradigm (not get confused, i am very much happy to see the progress in the removal of social discrimination of any kind currently going on), we will trash the majority of it, cos it always may/will contain stereotypes not acceptable today. as the saying goes, we should not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

No one's saying it should be thrown out, but there's a big middle ground between "never read this" and "there's nothing problematic here."  And man, there's a lot that's problematic.

I think it's really hard to dispute the white savior problem with Dune, even read in context.  Pale-skinned, aristocratic foreign Paul, who grew up in a rocky and cool climate, arrives at in underdeveloped desert area with one established "civilized" city and a vast desert region populated almost entirely by a dark-skinned indigenous people who are known for their physical prowess, survival skills, and deeply-felt strange customs.  He proceeds to take advantage of religious superstitions, deliberately planted by early colonizers, to assume power, and he brings the fantastic knowledge and skills of his culture to bear to organize the indigenous people into a "screaming jihad" for his own ends.  From first to last, it's the classic white savior story.  It's actually rather worse than some other famously problematic stories, like John Carter of Mars or Avatar, since it's so on-the-nose -- the Fremen are literally said to be the contemporary descendants of Muslims, while Paul's holy book is the Orange Catholic Bible.

None of that is to say that we shouldn't read the book.  Hell, I love the Barsoom stories (not Avatar, though -- can't believe they're making five more).  Definitely an amazing story and an amazing read.  It's just something readers should know about and think about, rather than unconsciously absorbing the implicit message buried within the story.

Quote from: Dr. Txec Róibeard dal Nordselvă, Esq., O.SPM, SMM on April 12, 2022, 08:29:06 AM

Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on April 12, 2022, 08:20:24 AM

Quote from: Muhammed Yasir on April 12, 2022, 07:44:40 AM
I'd like to nominate @Breneir Itravilatx - TNC Party Leader - as the Seneschal.
-Yasir

Only parties are allowed to make nominations for Seneschal, but I think that Yasir speaks for the Talossan National Congress as a whole.

For the nomination, it is preferable that party leaders make the nominations.

Thanks!

@Breneir Tzaracomprada , please get in here and nominate yourself.  Talossa gave the Talossan National Congress more votes than any other party -- the people want to see you as Seneschal.

Quote from: Muhammed Yasir on April 12, 2022, 07:44:40 AM
I'd like to nominate @Breneir Itravilatx - TNC Party Leader - as the Seneschal.
-Yasir

Only parties are allowed to make nominations for Seneschal, but I think that Yasir speaks for the Talossan National Congress as a whole.

If I understand correctly, the Túischac'h's only regular duty is to serve on the CRL.  They also help advise the Chancery and can fire the Secretary of State, but their only statutory duty is in the CRL to proofread bills.  In theory they could also issue recommendations, but that doesn't look like it's ever happened.  So it's basically a proofreading job.  @Marcel Eðo Pairescu Tafial , was that basically your experience?

Quote from: GV on April 11, 2022, 02:17:12 PM

Quote from: Breneir Tzaracomprada on April 10, 2022, 03:35:49 PM
I am delighted to see the TSFFWS is back.

Relatedly, to celebrate, I had a Bulleit Bourbon while watching the latest episodes of Star Trek: Picard and Halo on Paramount Plus.

What do you think of 'Picard'?  Is it worth getting Paramount Plus just to watch that?

I don't know about Picard, but I got Paramount Plus just to watch Star Trek: Discovery and I have no regrets at all.

Quote from: Breneir Tzaracomprada on April 11, 2022, 09:59:57 AM

Quote from: Dr. Txec Róibeard dal Nordselvă, Esq., O.SPM, SMM on April 11, 2022, 09:55:01 AM

Quote from: Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D. on April 10, 2022, 04:25:08 PM
Esteemed Fellow Citizens,

I have recently been made aware of the possibility of obtaining a seat in the upcoming Cosa as representative of the current new batch of citizens. Though I wish to chart a citizenship experience that is not focused on partisan politics, I do have an interest in studying Talossan public administration, and producing public research through the Royal Society. I thus see this as an opportunity for active, participant research, not to mention a civic duty.

Please consider this my petition to be assigned such a seat.

Azul,

This is a new provision of the Organic Law, but upon a close reading of the new sections, I have determined that new citizen Antonio Montagnha is indeed eligible to be granted one seat in the 57th Cosa, thereby increasing the size of the 57th Cosa to 201 seats. His seat will be assigned prior to the Seneschal election that will take place beginning on 5/1/2022.



Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă,
Secretár d'Estat

Dr. and MZ Montagnha, welcome to the Talossan Ziu. I look forward to working with you for the betterment of the Kingdom.

Breneir

Is it Dr MZ Montagnha or MC Dr Montagnha?

Bulleit used to be so good, but like five years ago they changed the blend.  It's a sad story.  I'm more of a gin man generally, but even I could taste the tragedy.