Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on February 13, 2023, 02:24:47 PMHmm, there must be another meaning to that idiom that I didn't realize.

I was not saying you missed the point, I was saying that you should not let claims like that upset you in any way. The people that make them are so obviously wrong that they don't deserve any of your brain space.

Sorry for the confusion.

Ohhhhhhh thanks for the clarification, now I feel silly ;D

I know that meaning, but I've also heard it used to say someone is missing the point. Similar to the phrase "it went over their head". I'm also sorry for the confusion  :)

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on February 13, 2023, 01:46:58 PM

Quote from: Carlüs Éovart Vilaçafat on February 13, 2023, 01:34:57 PM

Quote from: Bråneu Excelsio on February 13, 2023, 12:10:49 PMBut one of the things that always gets to me is when trans men students tell me they don't want to adopt masculine attitudes because they don't want to be assholes

As a man, I find this kind of offensive. As though the essence of masculinity resides in being an asshole. I have more thoughts, but I don't wish to derail the thread.

Like water off a duck's back

Are you saying I missed the point, @Ian Plätschisch? Or are you implying that I'm being an asshole for disagreeing with the premise that masculine = asshole? I thought I understood, and I don't see how I'm being an asshole. If you don't mind, please PM me and explain what I'm missing. Like I said, I don't want to derail the thread, but I do want to understand.

Quote from: Bråneu Excelsio on February 13, 2023, 12:10:49 PMGender is the social roles and expectations society put in you because of your sex [...]
We all decide on which part of the spectrum we are. That is gender identity.

This makes sense, however if these are the definitions that @Üc R. Tärfâ has in mind, then it seems nonsensical that the government could discriminate against you because of the expectation society puts on you.

You could argue that the government may discriminate based on how well you "fit" those societal roles/expectations, but again the only way to know that would be based on your gender identity. Which would make the inclusion of "gender" redundant given the inclusion of "sex" (presumably what genitals you have), and "gender identity" (where you choose to "present" on the masculine/feminine spectrum in your respective society).

Quote from: Bråneu Excelsio on February 13, 2023, 12:10:49 PMBut one of the things that always gets to me is when trans men students tell me they don't want to adopt masculine attitudes because they don't want to be assholes

As a man, I find this kind of offensive. As though the essence of masculinity resides in being an asshole. I have more thoughts, but I don't wish to derail the thread.

This is a very long list of "protected classes". Can some one explain why sex, gender, and gender identity all need to be listed?

Excuse the ignorance, but what is the fundamental difference between "gender" and "gender identity"? And how would we know your sex in order to discriminate against it, aside from your gender/gender identity?

I will vote for Lüc as well.

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on February 07, 2023, 10:10:39 AM

Quote from: Carlüs Éovart Vilaçafat on February 07, 2023, 08:27:55 AMSeparate from the Baron's request above, is there any reason that a citizen should be discriminated against by the government? Perhaps more high minded MZs than myself can come up with a reason.

Assuming there is not, if one of the purposes of this bill is to simplify the language, then why not bring it to it's logical conclusion:

Quote10. All citizens have equal social dignity, are equal before the law and may not be discriminated against or given preference for any reason with regards to any activity within the Kingdom and its territories. All rights and responsibilities deriving from and recognized by the law shall apply to all citizens equally.

The way this reads, citizens would not be able to form associations, become employed, or perform any other action that involves dealing with some people but not others.

All of life is discrimination. Anti-discrimination laws just create "protected classes" to prohibit discrimination on certain bases they don't approve of.

I completely agree, but I think we are discussing two different things. The actions of private business and groups are different from the actions of the government and application of the law. And perhaps I misunderstand, but a theoretical private Talossan business can say we didn't hire you because you're not qualified for the job, but the Talossan government can't say you broke the law but it's OK because of your political affiliation, or vice-versa.

The purpose of this bill, and the original statute in the Lexhatx seems to be about the application of the law, not the running of private businesses. But again, I leave open the possibility for misunderstanding on my part.

Separate from the Baron's request above, is there any reason that a citizen should be discriminated against by the government? Perhaps more high minded MZs than myself can come up with a reason.

Assuming there is not, if one of the purposes of this bill is to simplify the language, then why not bring it to it's logical conclusion:

Quote10. All citizens have equal social dignity, are equal before the law and may not be discriminated against or given preference for any reason with regards to any activity within the Kingdom and its territories. All rights and responsibilities deriving from and recognized by the law shall apply to all citizens equally.

I would also like to claim my seat in the Cabana.

I find it baffling that someone who takes judge neutrality so seriously is willing to completely throw away their principles on a (ironically politically motivated?) whim.

Quote from: Breneir Tzaracomprada on February 02, 2023, 07:45:13 PM

Quote from: Carlüs Éovart Vilaçafat on February 02, 2023, 07:02:57 PMI suppose this is as good a place to put this as any  ;D


Talossa, Talossa, land of red and green!
With ballots cast, and election clean,
The will of the people was heard and seen!

Talossa, Talossa, land of green and red!
On the shoulders of giants we now tread,
New dawn light begining to spread!

Talossa, Talossa, land for one and all!
It may be, that our Kingdom is small,
but the Talossan People will always stand tall!

This is beautiful, Carlus!

Meirci!

I suppose this is as good a place to put this as any  ;D


Talossa, Talossa, land of red and green!
With ballots cast, and election clean,
The will of the people was heard and seen!

Talossa, Talossa, land of green and red!
On the shoulders of giants we now tread,
New dawn light begining to spread!

Talossa, Talossa, land for one and all!
It may be, that our Kingdom is small,
but the Talossan People will always stand tall!

Personally, I like the look and obvious pronunciation of -arh.

I didn't realize that spelling was such a contentious issue.

Great work! Thanks for getting this up and so quickly!

Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on January 19, 2023, 03:25:13 PM

Quote from: Bråneu Excelsio on January 19, 2023, 03:21:26 PM

Quote from: Ián S.G. Txaglh on January 19, 2023, 02:48:24 PMjgyths  goms wbrt  l p=xmwno úskjwqnx  jszmd

loijftfrdewsa
(Så bel!)

Looks like goddamn Lojban to me :D

.i mi tugni do
.i la jufspi melbi mi  ;D

Quote from: Ián S.G. Txaglh on January 19, 2023, 05:08:53 AMcould not talossa have some kind of royal non-human manifestation, which would be a titular head of state, sacred symbol, spiritual leader, popular figure, and attractive force? i would recommend a cat. it's already worked once, to quote the classics (cimrman, svěrák & smoljak - play czech heaven [české nebe]). so many problems would it solve, so much of a cuteness would it bring 8)

An interesting idea! However the problem is that, sure the "King" may be more active, but the activity will be something along the lines of:

sfk;lghjsdfglheriughsdlfkjhglskhslurhglk gk jlkg hsurhgr gslughr;ggn;fdkhgbd jgrbsrgz;gb za gnba;ehjrt