Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on August 03, 2020, 12:15:57 AM
BE IT ENACTED etc. etc. that the following subsection be added to section H.11 of El Lexhatx:

QuoteThe Ziu may, by a 2/3 majority in each chamber, elect a Clerk of Legislation, to be known as El Xhenistà, who will proofread and suggest revisions to all bills to be Clarked, and may request the Secretary of State to exercise their powers under this sub-section to withdraw any bill from the Clark.

This is adorable.

Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on August 03, 2020, 12:04:37 AM

Quote from: Breneir Itravilatx on August 02, 2020, 11:58:24 PM
I love getting name-checked after hitting a nerve.

I think you're letting your 87.5% majority go to your head there, bro

Epic comeback. The use of the word "bro" in connection with my use of it (twice!) In the Florencia boards is a nice twist. Exquisite. :-)

I am chastened. 

Quote from: Açafat del Val on August 02, 2020, 08:25:15 PM

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on August 02, 2020, 08:14:59 PM
The LCC is still in very early days and just spent the entire election providing alternative proposals to the Free Democrats. I can assure you there will be no shortage of LCC participation in the coming months.

Respectfully: (a) I look forward to this participation, but (b) if Davinescu does not partake in this participate then he should be silent.

He can participate without or under the color of the LCC - his choice - but the principle remains. For that matter, it applies to other LCC members (such as the incumbent Governor of Florencia).

Ian, it is unacceptable to attack (even implicitly) a provincial Constitution which even Breneir critiqued and tweaked in concert with me. That's call intellectual dishonesty. I am well aware that this particular subject is well outside the bounds of this specific topic, but I bring it up to make a wider point: if the LCC is going to commence its opposition by slinging poo and arguing in bad faith, then it's a pretty poor opposition.

Attacking the FreeDems (and, conversely, attacking the LCC or NPW) is not how we rebuild or improve Talossa.

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on August 02, 2020, 08:20:41 PM

Quote from: Açafat del Val on August 02, 2020, 07:59:00 PM
Operative word: these criticisms, not all criticisms. It's not my fault that you extrapolated past the plain language.

[picture]

;D ;)

I love getting name-checked after hitting a nerve in another section of our forum. None of this rises above a (continuing) fit of pique but it is amusing to watch.

Quote from: Açafat del Val on August 02, 2020, 01:07:02 PM
I don't know about cool stories, but they are true stories. Is this a dare to attach the email chain as well as link the Google Doc? I have no qualms about disclosing proof that the Governor and the Constable had a chance to remedy this themselves and now one of them has the gumption to pretend it's not his own shared failure.

You'll have a virtual monopoly in the next term. Have at it. Hell, write a new constitution altogether. But don't condescend Florencia with this intellectual dishonesty and passive aggression.

If you had the time to use riposte in a sentence, then you surely have time to write something more constructive and befitting of your office than "cool stories, bro".

Yeah, sure, post away. Use your time as you wish. They would be cool stories, bro...
As I said I am looking forward to getting this issue fixed through amendment once the Nimlet is convened.

Quote from: Açafat del Val on August 02, 2020, 12:25:45 PM
It is not difficult at all to accept blame when an error has occurred.

However, I stand by my assessment: the incumbent Secretary of State is being obnoxious. Perhaps he is not an obnoxious character or an obnoxious personality, but his decision in this matter is obnoxious and unduly burdensome. It is not unreasonable on behalf of this province to interpret IX.3, which says in part...

QuoteProvinces may conduct their elections themselves or delegate the conduction of their elections to the Chancery.

...as having the power to compel the Chancery to perform a simple ministerial task of the election.

I would like to point out that the incumbent Governor was invited to, and in fact did, collaborate on the same Constitution which is now posing an issue. The incumbent Constable (and King, for that matter) was invited likewise, but neglected to offer much constructive or substantial feedback. Certainly, if they had foreseen this same issue, then they would have spoken up.

I also point out, perhaps to our collective chagrin, that both the Governor and the Constable have had to be reminded during the previous Nimlet term to perform their provincial duties and, at least in one case, failed completely to do so despite those reminders. Worse: in another case, one of them took offense at having been reminded and informed - not threatened - of a potential lawsuit to compel constitutionally required performance.

One may call it ironic that a person would have been offended by a lawsuit seeking to remedy their own nonfeasance, but would then compliment and condone a malfeasant Secretary of State whose only defense is, "If you don't like it, sue me".

It is extremely pitiful that a lawsuit, whether potential or actual, is the only thing that gets attention in Florencia and produces results.

Mea culpas aren't difficult. I do hope that the named officeholders choose also to accept blame and work to fix their own errors.

Cool stories, bro.
Looking forward to the commencement of the next Nimlet. Let's get this situation fixed.  :D

Quote from: Glüc da Dhi S.H. on August 02, 2020, 11:45:42 AM
Well thanks...

The Chancery does not report to the nimlet, yet without consultation you wrote a provincial law telling the Chancery what to do. Nothing is stopping you from going to the CpI if you think I'm breaking the OrgLaw. I've tried to explain my perspective on this. Fine if you disagree with my interpretation, but please don't call me obnoxious.

(Edit: I'm fine with stubborn though)

Excellent riposte.

Quote from: Açafat del Val on August 02, 2020, 10:47:17 AM
To be extremely clear: There is no clarity on the matter. The Chancery has to complete this for us, by provincial law, or we have to break the law. It's cut and dried.

I personally would like to wait, in hopes that a successor SoS will do what his predecessor stubbornly and obnoxiously refused to do.

I appreciate you taking responsibility for this debacle.
Mea culpas are sometimes difficult.
And for providing necessary clarity on the matter.

I don't know if the Secretary of State was consulted before the Constitution came into effect but he did seem blindsided. And definitely has a different interpretation of The Chancery's role in facilitating provincial elections. I wrote this before Gluc's response.

If we do not have a Secretary of State appointee (I assume we will) by the deadlines stated in our Constitution (and enter that "weird gray zone" you referenced in an earlier post) then I will revisit this issue.

Breneir

Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on August 01, 2020, 09:41:03 PM
As the SoS is resigning, maybe his successor will sort this out.

This appears to be a constitutional issue. The power to fix seats and set commencement dates was moved from the Governor to the Chancery in the recent overhaul. The now-resigned SOS expressed reservations and the position is now (or soon-to-be-vacant).

Acting in a caretaker role as outgoing Governor I am happy to complete these administrative functions but there will need to be clarity on the matter.

FreeDems came within a hair's breadth of majority. LCC did quite well in the provinces (at least the ones I can see were run by the Chancery).

Quote from: Açafat del Val on July 20, 2020, 10:22:30 AM
Although this is a subform specifically for Florencia, I invite anyone of the greater Talossan public to comment or answer.

If this is truly the case, then I wrote in a terrible provision of the new provincial constitution. I had interpreted IX.3 far differently; it seems pretty plain to me that "...may...delegate the conduction of their elections to the Chancery" includes the very basic tasks of announcing the results and fixing the proportion of seats.

Florencia needs a firm answer here. If the SoS is refusing to fix the number of seats, apportion them, and delcare an arbitrary day for the commencement of the new Nimlet session, then Florencia will enter a weird grey zone because the Constitution outright specifies that the Chancery must do it. Without the Chancery, there is legally no Nimlet... and without a Nimlet, there is legally no way to amend the Constitution and prevent this.

Will the SoS do this, or not?

But futhermore, what is the extent to which a province may, under OrgLaw IX.3, "delegate" its elections to the Chancery?

It looks like the Secretary of State is currently conducting the Florencian provincial election. But I am still unclear on the plans on how to proceed, post-Election, based on the quandary described below:

"...to fix the number of seats, apportion them, and delcare [sic] an arbitrary day for the commencement of the new Nimlet session, then Florencia will enter a weird grey zone because the Constitution outright specifies that the Chancery must do it. Without the Chancery, there is legally no Nimlet... and without a Nimlet, there is legally no way to amend the Constitution and prevent this."

Who will be fixing and apportioning seats, declaring a commencement day in order to prevent the "weird gray zone" created by the new Constitution?

Per, RZ23 - The Uniform Seneschál Election Act
Per, RZ24 - The Uniform Túischac'h Election Act
Per, RZ25 - Judiciary Amendment of 2020
Per, RZ26 - The Non-Hereditary Monarchy Amendment
VC, Yes

Burgermeister,

Can you share a bit more info about Varo? I am familiar with Ally Bank but not this particular institution.

Breneir

Seeing that this is the official thread for the ongoing Nimlet session convened on 22 December I will make any posts in continuance of the session here.

Pursuant to Article III, Section 4 of the Florencian Constitution I, Breneir Itravilatx, Governor of Florencia, do hereby place my signature for the Resolution to Amend the Florencian Constitution in Whole as duly approved by a vote of the current session of the House of Shepherds.

Pursuant to the same section of our Constitution I do also send this Resolution for consideration to our Constable.

/s/
Breneir Itravilatx

Quote from: Açafat del Val on May 15, 2020, 02:52:52 PM
Seeing also that 15 days have passed since the deadline for this Resolution, and believing that that is or was sufficient time for the Governor to have delivered the instrument as according to law, I do now also notify my esteemed colleagues of my intent to file suit with the Uppermost Cort of Talossa seeking a Writ of Mandamus to compel action of the Governor, or of some other competent authority, so that the instrument may be duly delivered, and only if the Governor does not make the delivery within the next 24 hours.

Thanks for that.

Quote from: Açafat del Val on January 09, 2020, 10:17:38 AM
I wish to apologize personally to the Governor and generally to the people of Florencia for the overall quietness on my part. Certainly I have not done a good job to transition to the New Wittenberg.

To my esteemed colleague, Mr. Mximo: there is a draft proposal yet of a new constitution for our beloved province, and it will be ready soon for presentment to the public. I, the Governor, and the sitting Constable have worked on it in the past 6 weeks.

Having said that, I want to address the following...

Quote from: mximo on December 27, 2019, 11:47:57 PM
- The governor should be elected every cosa election.
- We should introduce delay and rules for the Nimlet.
- The nimlet should be the one who name the Senator in case of vacancy.
- The Custaval should not be able to vetos a Nimlet resolution without the Nimlet be able to remove it by a 2/3 votes.

The draft, as it currently is constituted, does introduce rules for the Nimlet. Check.
It also introduces the ability of the Nimlet to override a veto by 2/3 votes. Check.
Unfortunately, however, it would inOrganic at this time to allow that a Senator be chosen in any manner by the Nimlet.
Lastly, why should the governor be elected at all?

Welcome back Senator del Val

Quote from: mximo on December 23, 2019, 10:03:40 AM
Azul

Do we plan a New organic law for our province?

I think its Time no?
Mximo

Mximo,

There may be a proposal soon forthcoming for a revamped provincial constitution. Are there any sections or parts of the current provincial constitution which you think are in need of revision?

Breneir