New Citizen Seat Debate

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Is there any sort of "grandfather" clause for those of us who became citizens just before the last election?

According to my reading and interpretation of Section 4.1 of the Organic Law, you would have had to become eligible to vote after the most recent election deadline. You became eligible to vote on May of 2021. Unfortunately you don't qualify for this new provision of law. A political party may give you seats if they so chose, however. There is provision in law for that.

Sorry if this isn't the answer you were hoping for.

It is the answer I expected. Honestly I'm probably not smart enough to hold a seat anyway LOL

If you would like to hold a seat, I bet the TNC can arrange that. Not like... a ton of seats. But everyone who wants to should get to participate in government. Are you interested?

[Tric'hard Lenxheir]

Is there any sort of "grandfather" clause for those of us who became citizens just before the last election?

According to my reading and interpretation of Section 4.1 of the Organic Law, you would have had to become eligible to vote after the most recent election deadline. You became eligible to vote on May of 2021. Unfortunately you don't qualify for this new provision of law. A political party may give you seats if they so chose, however. There is provision in law for that.

Sorry if this isn't the answer you were hoping for.

It is the answer I expected. Honestly I'm probably not smart enough to hold a seat anyway LOL

If you would like to hold a seat, I bet the TNC can arrange that. Not like... a ton of seats. But everyone who wants to should get to participate in government. Are you interested?

Do I have to officially join the party first? Do I have to toe the party line or can I vote my conscience?

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Is there any sort of "grandfather" clause for those of us who became citizens just before the last election?

According to my reading and interpretation of Section 4.1 of the Organic Law, you would have had to become eligible to vote after the most recent election deadline. You became eligible to vote on May of 2021. Unfortunately you don't qualify for this new provision of law. A political party may give you seats if they so chose, however. There is provision in law for that.

Sorry if this isn't the answer you were hoping for.

It is the answer I expected. Honestly I'm probably not smart enough to hold a seat anyway LOL

If you would like to hold a seat, I bet the TNC can arrange that. Not like... a ton of seats. But everyone who wants to should get to participate in government. Are you interested?

Do I have to officially join the party first? Do I have to toe the party line or can I vote my conscience?

Well, hold on, if you're interested let me talk to my party and my party leader.  I can't just decide that, I'm afraid.

EDIT: We're going to chat about it -- give me a couple of days and I'll get back to you.  I doubt very much it will generally be a "toe the line" deal.

[Miestră Schivă, UrN]

Tric'hard, you honestly want to join the anti-government party? When the FreeDems asked you before the election whether you wanted to join the party list and win seats "the honest way", and you told us no?  :(

If it's going to be like that, I'm equally authorised to ask the Free Democrats to give you a seat or two.

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Tric'hard, you honestly want to join the anti-government party? When the FreeDems asked you before the election whether you wanted to join the party list and win seats "the honest way", and you told us no?  :(

What exactly is dishonest about this?  He's not joining the party -- although he's more than welcome to! -- but rather just interested in serving the Cosa and I'm trying to help him make that happen.  He wasn't on anybody's list, but I don't see how that's a big deal.

[Miestră Schivă, UrN]

On one level, you know precisely what I think of offering new citizens seats post-election; what I have always thought of it; the several legal reforms I've brought in to make it unnecessary and difficult.

On another level, Tric'hard is a valuable citizen and I did my best to offer him a place on the FreeDems list, but he declined. Surprised to see him change his mind, that's all.

The whole idea of giving free seats to new citizens is that they're unrepresented in the Cosa. But Tric'hard voted, so he is represented. I would heartily support him taking seats from whichever party he voted for.

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

On one level, you know precisely what I think of offering new citizens seats post-election; what I have always thought of it; the several legal reforms I've brought in to make it unnecessary and difficult.

On another level, Tric'hard is a valuable citizen and I did my best to offer him a place on the FreeDems list, but he declined. Surprised to see him change his mind, that's all.

The whole idea of giving free seats to new citizens is that they're unrepresented in the Cosa. But Tric'hard voted, so he is represented. I would heartily support him taking seats from whichever party he voted for.

Well, considering how you just voted for Breneir's bill last term which gives out the seats in this very thread, I sort of assumed that you'd seen the light.  It's pretty obvious that new citizens want to get involved as they get interested, here they are asking to get involved, and we should make it possible for all of them to do so.  But whatever, it doesn't really matter.

Anyway, he voted in secret, so there's no way to know for which party.  My party is discussing how we can make it possible for him to join the Cosa and have fun legislating and such, if he's interested.  If the FDT wants to join in and help, that would be wonderful.

[Tric'hard Lenxheir]

Tric'hard, you honestly want to join the anti-government party? When the FreeDems asked you before the election whether you wanted to join the party list and win seats "the honest way", and you told us no?  :(

If it's going to be like that, I'm equally authorised to ask the Free Democrats to give you a seat or two.

That is my point, I don't want to join any of the parties. I have my own opinions and I think both of the bigger parties spend way too much time sniping at each other instead of trying to find areas in which they can compromise.

[Tric'hard Lenxheir]

Tric'hard, you honestly want to join the anti-government party? When the FreeDems asked you before the election whether you wanted to join the party list and win seats "the honest way", and you told us no?  :(

If it's going to be like that, I'm equally authorised to ask the Free Democrats to give you a seat or two.

I would also point out that the TNC asked me to join their party as well and I refused them as well. I have not joined any party. I would be willing to take a seat from any party as long as it did not require me to vote strictly along party lines. I don't have the income to run my own campaign which is why I never tried, plus I think some here view independent candidates as somewhat of a joke.

[Sir Txec dal Nordselvă, UrB]

I have acted as Administrator of Wittenberg and moved several posts into a new thread. The moved posts, likely unintentionally, violated Wittiquette in that it caused a thread to be derailed. 

[Tric'hard Lenxheir]

I have acted as Administrator of Wittenberg and moved several posts into a new thread. The moved posts, likely unintentionally, violated Wittiquette in that it caused a thread to be derailed.

Thank you and I apologize for my part in the violation.

[Miestră Schivă, UrN]

Well, considering how you just voted for Breneir's bill

"Brenéir's bill" whose first draft was written by me, based on a proposal that was first raised at the last FreeDems convention ;D No offence to the Senator, but this was a cross-party initiative.

The idea of giving seats as of right to new and therefore unrepresented citizens is precisely so newbies could get involved without what I still see as the corrupting effect of existing parties handing out the political equivalent of candy from a windowless van.

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Well, considering how you just voted for Breneir's bill

"Brenéir's bill" whose first draft was written by me, based on a proposal that was first raised at the last FreeDems convention ;D No offence to the Senator, but this was a cross-party initiative.

You're absolutely right, that was definitely a cross-party effort.  And it is delightful to read that post and see that it began with an acknowledgment that it really is important to let new citizens have an opportunity to jump right into the legislature and participate.  I'm glad you're listening.  Don't worry, I have a lot more ideas.  We'll get things gradually sorted.  The new Talossan Renaissance will keep on running if we just keep working and fixing things!

[Ian Plätschisch]

Well, considering how you just voted for Breneir's bill last term which gives out the seats in this very thread, I sort of assumed that you'd seen the light.  It's pretty obvious that new citizens want to get involved as they get interested, here they are asking to get involved, and we should make it possible for all of them to do so.  But whatever, it doesn't really matter.

This is a bit annoying. I'm sure you know that the FreeDems were not upset over the prospect of S:reu Lenxheir being able to get involved. We didn't like that it appeared to be a cheap attempt to get another supporter for the TNC, even if that's not what you intended. Don't misrepresent us.

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Well, considering how you just voted for Breneir's bill last term which gives out the seats in this very thread, I sort of assumed that you'd seen the light.  It's pretty obvious that new citizens want to get involved as they get interested, here they are asking to get involved, and we should make it possible for all of them to do so.  But whatever, it doesn't really matter.

This is a bit annoying. I'm sure you know that the FreeDems were not upset over the prospect of S:reu Lenxheir being able to get involved. We didn't like that it appeared to be a cheap attempt to get another supporter for the TNC, even if that's not what you intended. Don't misrepresent us.

I don't see anywhere that I asked him to join the party, asked him to obey instructions and exchange for the seat, or anything else. All I offered was that we would like to help him have fun by holding a seat in the legislature. I very much doubt that he is so cheaply bought.