Science Fiction Discussion - Remembrance of Earth's Past/Three Body Problem

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

I just completed the English translation (obviously) of the Remembrance of Earth's Past trilogy and I cannot recommend it enough. Deeply inventive science fiction that blends the extreme end of our theoretical physics knowledge, with sociology and philosophy is a rare product. It's haunting and challenging. For me, it was both an incredible and all to possible depiction of interaction between societies not only with completely different biology and evolutionary environments, but significant technological differences.

The only major problem with the work is the complete lack of human sexuality or gender diversity. It strikes me that this may be an artifact of writing a novel for publication in the People's Republic of China. 

https://www.goodreads.com/series/189931-remembrance-of-earth-s-past

Has anyone else read the series?

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing? 

[Breneir Tzaracomprada]

Yes, I read the series last year if I recall correctly.
I remember thinking that the debate by humanity over the encroaching Trisolarans went differently than I would have expected.
I assumed that debate was shaped by the differences in worldview between collectivist and individualist societies.

Incredibly inventive story, I agree. I still struggle to wrap my mind around 4D space.

[Baron Alexandreu Davinescu]

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

LOL. Once I am a citizen, I'll certainly consider it.

[Breneir Tzaracomprada]

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

LOL. Once I am a citizen, I'll certainly consider it.

Just one more day to go  ;D

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

Yes, I read the series last year if I recall correctly.
I remember thinking that the debate by humanity over the encroaching Trisolarans went differently than I would have expected.
I assumed that debate was shaped by the differences in worldview between collectivist and individualist societies.

Incredibly inventive story, I agree. I still struggle to wrap my mind around 4D space.

To be sure, the series can be read as a debate between the various advantages of collectivist and individualist societies. To its great create the narrative show how the needs are situational. There are at lease to world altering character choices the needed a more individualistic approach, while broadly speaking humanity would have been better off with more collectivist decision making.

*********SPOILERS*********

Specifically...

The second "Swordholder's" decision to not use the Dark Forest deterrent was a grave error, but not as grave as humanity electing her because of her compassionate and collectivist sentiments. The same character's decision to not back the development of lightspeed technology, the only technology that could have saved humanity, was also a grave error based on conflict avoidance instead of logical reasoning. So much of this narrative is based around the idea of humanity's long established inability to think strategically about long term problems.

[Ián S.G. Txaglh]

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

LOL. Once I am a citizen, I'll certainly consider it.

i tried to re-animate TSF&WS ages ago (afaik was originally founded by ián anglatzara back in days), in early 2007, but i was pretty alone then, so i resigned a few months later with no feedback and company. if interested i can send you the archive of my 'n gñhevnic da liréir, i have published for TSF&WS.

i have read the "three-body problem" and i will somehow paddle against the stream. i did not like it at all. it was full of gaps in logic, e.g. how a well-trained engineer never encountered the three-body problem? it contained pointless parts, like "the game", which hardly served any role in the story-telling. and the extraterrestrians were depicted so naively, i felt like being back in 70ies. i never had the strength to read the second book. my wife, who is a philologist focused on fantastic literature, she made it through the second but refused then to go through the third ;) if to pick a good author of chinese origin, ted chiang is my choice.

[Breneir Tzaracomprada]

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

LOL. Once I am a citizen, I'll certainly consider it.

i tried to re-animate TSF&WS ages ago (afaik was originally founded by ián anglatzara back in days), in early 2007, but i was pretty alone then, so i resigned a few months later with no feedback and company. if interested i can send you the archive of my 'n gñhevnic da liréir, i have published for TSF&WS.

i have read the "three-body problem" and i will somehow paddle against the stream. i did not like it at all. it was full of gaps in logic, e.g. how a well-trained engineer never encountered the three-body problem? it contained pointless parts, like "the game", which hardly served any role in the story-telling. and the extraterrestrians were depicted so naively, i felt like being back in 70ies. i never had the strength to read the second book. my wife, who is a philologist focused on fantastic literature, she made it through the second but refused then to go through the third ;) if to pick a good author of chinese origin, ted chiang is my choice.

I have only read one of the short story collections by Chiang but I would agree that he is a fantastic story-teller.

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

I am curious, would it be a better narrative if you viewed it as a metaphor for a single person's struggle to find meaning?

Also, is the Talossan Science Fiction & Whisky Society still a thing?

Not really, as far as I know.  You should declare it is again, though, and appoint yourself as presedint.

LOL. Once I am a citizen, I'll certainly consider it.

i tried to re-animate TSF&WS ages ago (afaik was originally founded by ián anglatzara back in days), in early 2007, but i was pretty alone then, so i resigned a few months later with no feedback and company. if interested i can send you the archive of my 'n gñhevnic da liréir, i have published for TSF&WS.

i have read the "three-body problem" and i will somehow paddle against the stream. i did not like it at all. it was full of gaps in logic, e.g. how a well-trained engineer never encountered the three-body problem? it contained pointless parts, like "the game", which hardly served any role in the story-telling. and the extraterrestrians were depicted so naively, i felt like being back in 70ies. i never had the strength to read the second book. my wife, who is a philologist focused on fantastic literature, she made it through the second but refused then to go through the third ;) if to pick a good author of chinese origin, ted chiang is my choice.

[Ián S.G. Txaglh]

I am curious, would it be a better narrative if you viewed it as a metaphor for a single person's struggle to find meaning?

honestly, hardly. no matter how hard i try, i don't see that metaphor in the story. plus, it is written so badly, i have, unfortunately, difficulties finding anything interesting in it. maybe, the very first part, during the maoist period, at least this part would be somehow interesting if not just a mild (party approved) reflection of the period.

there is maybe one part close to the metaphor you've mentioned, the "game", but unfortunately, i find it shallow and pointless, and with an increased number of appearances also quite boring. so man trivialities with no added value.

i am really sorry, i was quite disappointed by the development of the story, and the closer i was to the final of the first book, the more disappointed i was, e.g. how could a member of the civilisation cry for not having literature and art; how could he know what it means, what is its value? that was what brought me back to the period of SF when it was (mis)used to write bad stories full of pseudo-philosophical non-sense hidden behind seriously looking mumbo-jumbo. there was an excellent book published in 1981 called "saiäns-fiktschen" by german author franz fühman, who made fun of it in a very sophisticated way.

if to name a SF book(s), depicting the struggle to find meaning, i would go for "ubik" by PKD, "fiasco" by lem or if smth more modern than "witcher" by sapkowski (oh, gods, that has to be a special room in hell for screenwriters who fucked-up good books into bad TV series). or smth by ted chiang, e.g. "story of your life" or "division by zero" :)

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

I can understand some of your criticism. I do wonder how much of the issue is the quality of the translation. For example, I though the dialogue was clunky and problematic in many ways, as if the author or translator didn't understand 1. how professionals talk to each other, 2. how people with romantic interests in each other speak. That could also be mostly due to cultural differences.

I agree that the period of the first novel set during the Cultural Revolution was the most authentic and affecting, likely because the author and his family went through a similar experience. There was also a key character in the second and third books who I would identify as likely high-functioning autistic (Asperger's) and that also seemed on the nose from my family and educational experience.

Perhaps I saw meaning in this work for the same reason I enjoyed many element of the first season of Star Trek: Picard. Specifically, I have been in a place in my own life over the past three plus years that have been difficult, demanding reflection, reassessment, and course changes. To paraphrase the author of The Leftovers, life is full of completely predictable tragedies, but that does change the effect they have on you.

I've appreciated your insights.   

I am curious, would it be a better narrative if you viewed it as a metaphor for a single person's struggle to find meaning?

honestly, hardly. no matter how hard i try, i don't see that metaphor in the story. plus, it is written so badly, i have, unfortunately, difficulties finding anything interesting in it. maybe, the very first part, during the maoist period, at least this part would be somehow interesting if not just a mild (party approved) reflection of the period.

there is maybe one part close to the metaphor you've mentioned, the "game", but unfortunately, i find it shallow and pointless, and with an increased number of appearances also quite boring. so man trivialities with no added value.

i am really sorry, i was quite disappointed by the development of the story, and the closer i was to the final of the first book, the more disappointed i was, e.g. how could a member of the civilisation cry for not having literature and art; how could he know what it means, what is its value? that was what brought me back to the period of SF when it was (mis)used to write bad stories full of pseudo-philosophical non-sense hidden behind seriously looking mumbo-jumbo. there was an excellent book published in 1981 called "saiäns-fiktschen" by german author franz fühman, who made fun of it in a very sophisticated way.

if to name a SF book(s), depicting the struggle to find meaning, i would go for "ubik" by PKD, "fiasco" by lem or if smth more modern than "witcher" by sapkowski (oh, gods, that has to be a special room in hell for screenwriters who fucked-up good books into bad TV series). or smth by ted chiang, e.g. "story of your life" or "division by zero" :)

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

Also...

Starfleet in the 32nd century has a small starship named after the author...

https://shop.eaglemoss.com/us/hero-collector/star-trek/uss-liu-cixin-starship

[King John]

FWIW, I didn't like The Three-Body Problem much.  So much of the story had to do with the physics of the 3-sun system, and the author got the physics all wrong.  Bah humbug.  :-)

-- John R