The Obligatory Star Trek Ranking Post

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

This is all a matter of purely personal taste, though you could have discussions on everything from production values, script quality, and place in the cannon. Shows still in production may be subject to re-evaluation. I think Prodigy has the biggest potential to move up, with Strange New Worlds yet to be rated.

Series:
DS9
TNG
Lower Decks
TOS
Enterprise
VOY
Prodigy
Discovery
TAS
Picard

Movies:
TWOK
Undiscovered Country
First Contact
Voyage Home
TMP (especially the newly released director's cut/remaster)
Search for Spock
Generations
Insurrection
Nemesis
Final Frontier

NOTE: The JJverse is meaningless to me and in my mind disrespectful to the fan community. I don't rank them at all.

[Breneir Tzaracomprada]

Series:
TNG
DS9
Picard
Lower Decks
VOY
TOS
Discovery
Prodigy
TAS
Enterprise

Movies:
TMP (especially the newly released director's cut/remaster)
Undiscovered Country
First Contact
Generations
TWOK
Voyage Home
Search for Spock
Insurrection
Final Frontier
Nemesis

[Carlüs Éovart Vilaçafat]

NOTE: The JJverse is meaningless to me and in my mind disrespectful to the fan community. I don't rank them at all.

I've tried several times to get into Star Trek. DS9 in particular because I heard nothing but good things about it. Unfortunately, the closest I've ever gotten is TNG with my grandfather when I was a child. I've always been more of a Star Wars guy myself, so I'm curious to hear why you think the newer films by JJ Abrams are disrespectful to the fans.

I do feel this way about the 3 recent Star Wars movies done by Abrams, and my reasoning is that he pretty much took the original trilogy and re-shot them with different actors and different aliens. Almost like he was afraid to actually do something original so he just rehashed the originals. Or a less charitable reading: He just wanted to cash in on a generation's nostalgia.

[Antonio Montagnha, Ed. D.]

To encapsulate my thoughts...

1. Abrams intentionally threw 50 years of continuity and storytelling out the door, not just by jumping to an alternate universe but by destroying the home world of a major race in the prime universe to do so. He and his team did so by publicly stating that it was too hard to make the story they wanted to make in the Star Trek universe. They wanted the built in fan base but want nothing to do with actually honoring the work and fan investment that came before them. This not only dishonors the fanbase, but Star Trek creators like D.C. Fontana, Ron Moore, and Mike McMahan who have for great ways to push the narrative forward while maintaining the integrity of the franchise.

2. They abused the characters, and Spock is a great example. Deep fans of Trek know that it isn't that Vulcans (in in this case half-Vulcan) have no emotion, rather they have so much emotion they trained themselves to rely more on logic as a way to save themselves from their violent and irrational choices. The character of Spock constantly struggles with this and can be best observed in The Motion Picture and the Undiscover Country. But Abrams' version shows Spock throwing away his lifetime of training and culture at the drop of a hate. This version of Spock is petty, violent, jealous, only give mouth service to logic.  It speaks to a complete misunderstand of a core character.

3. Abrams is lazy. Whether he is offering weak and watered down versions of Spielberg, Kasdan, or others, he has done nothing truly original in his entire career.  He entries in to Trek are warmed over and weaken plots take from film and television makers who are his betters.


I went to see all three of the JJverse movies in theaters because as a Star Trek fan it was the only game in town. Now that I have have Trek on my TV at home nearly every week, I don't think I'll need to involve myself in that again.

NOTES ON STAR WARS

I though The Last Jedi had some decent ideas, but the Force Awakes was an unoriginal remake, and Skywalker was awful and dumb. I think it is clear that Abrams had no plan for the trilogy and no philosophical point to his narrative, such as it was. It's a shame. There is a lot of storytelling left in the Star Wars universe. What is your opinion of Rebels and Mandolorian?

NOTE: The JJverse is meaningless to me and in my mind disrespectful to the fan community. I don't rank them at all.

I've tried several times to get into Star Trek. DS9 in particular because I heard nothing but good things about it. Unfortunately, the closest I've ever gotten is TNG with my grandfather when I was a child. I've always been more of a Star Wars guy myself, so I'm curious to hear why you think the newer films by JJ Abrams are disrespectful to the fans.

I do feel this way about the 3 recent Star Wars movies done by Abrams, and my reasoning is that he pretty much took the original trilogy and re-shot them with different actors and different aliens. Almost like he was afraid to actually do something original so he just rehashed the originals. Or a less charitable reading: He just wanted to cash in on a generation's nostalgia.

[Carlüs Éovart Vilaçafat]

To encapsulate my thoughts...

1. Abrams intentionally threw 50 years of continuity and storytelling out the door, not just by jumping to an alternate universe but by destroying the home world of a major race in the prime universe to do so. He and his team did so by publicly stating that it was too hard to make the story they wanted to make in the Star Trek universe. They wanted the built in fan base but want nothing to do with actually honoring the work and fan investment that came before them. This not only dishonors the fanbase, but Star Trek creators like D.C. Fontana, Ron Moore, and Mike McMahan who have for great ways to push the narrative forward while maintaining the integrity of the franchise.

2. They abused the characters, and Spock is a great example. Deep fans of Trek know that it isn't that Vulcans (in in this case half-Vulcan) have no emotion, rather they have so much emotion they trained themselves to rely more on logic as a way to save themselves from their violent and irrational choices. The character of Spock constantly struggles with this and can be best observed in The Motion Picture and the Undiscover Country. But Abrams' version shows Spock throwing away his lifetime of training and culture at the drop of a hate. This version of Spock is petty, violent, jealous, only give mouth service to logic.  It speaks to a complete misunderstand of a core character.

3. Abrams is lazy. Whether he is offering weak and watered down versions of Spielberg, Kasdan, or others, he has done nothing truly original in his entire career.  He entries in to Trek are warmed over and weaken plots take from film and television makers who are his betters.


I went to see all three of the JJverse movies in theaters because as a Star Trek fan it was the only game in town. Now that I have have Trek on my TV at home nearly every week, I don't think I'll need to involve myself in that again.

NOTES ON STAR WARS

I though The Last Jedi had some decent ideas, but the Force Awakes was an unoriginal remake, and Skywalker was awful and dumb. I think it is clear that Abrams had no plan for the trilogy and no philosophical point to his narrative, such as it was. It's a shame. There is a lot of storytelling left in the Star Wars universe. What is your opinion of Rebels and Mandolorian?

That makes perfect sense, and it sounds like that seems to be his MO.

I can't comment on Rebels because I haven't seen it and I've only seen a few episodes of Clone Wars and the Bad Batch.
The Mandalorian however, I thought was great (minus how season 2 ended). I loved how it explored the Star Wars universe outside the Empire/rebel framing for the most part. It really reminded me of Firefly, one of my favorite shows.

Anyway, I didn't mean to hijack the thread, just got curious!