[CRL] The Hand Of The King Needs No Glove Puppet Amendment

Started by Miestră Schivă, UrN, October 03, 2023, 06:54:04 PM

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Miestră Schivă, UrN

WHEREAS Cunstaváis serve for an indefinite term, which encourages a do-nothing attitude:

BE IT ENACTED that Organic Law XI.4 be amended from the current:

QuoteThe King shall appoint a Cunstavál (or Constable) for each Province. Until such time as the King or Cunstavál proclaims a provincial constitution providing otherwise, a Province's Cunstavál shall serve as Military Governor and may exercise all the powers of the provincial government. No Cunstavál shall proclaim any provincial constitution, nor shall any province pass a constitutional amendment, which conflicts with any provision of this Organic Law or with any other national law, or grants to the Cunstavál royal powers less extensive than those granted to the King on the national level (except that the provincial royal powers need not include a right of dissolution if provincial elections are held concurrently with Cosâ elections). No Cunstavál shall proclaim any provincial constitution which has not been approved by a referendum in which at least either a majority of all citizens of the province or a two-thirds majority of votes actually cast is in favor of the constitution. No person shall be at the same time Cunstavál of one province and the leader of the provincial government of another province.

to read in its entirety as follows:

Quote1. Every royal power that the King possesses as granted by this Organic Law shall also apply to the provincial governments; with the exception that the provincial royal powers need not include a right of dissolution if provincial elections are held concurrently with Cosâ elections.

2. The King may appoint a Cunstavál (or Constable) for any Province to exercise these powers on his behalf, for a term not exceeding three years. The King may reappoint a Cunstavál. The terms of existing Cunstaváis shall expire no later than three years after the adoption of this amendment.

3. Until such time as the King or Cunstavál proclaims a provincial constitution providing otherwise, the King or Cunstavál shall serve as Military Governor and may exercise all the powers of the provincial government.

4. The King or Cunstavál shall not proclaim any provincial constitution, nor shall any province pass a constitutional amendment, which conflicts with any provision of this Organic Law or with any other national law.

5. The King or Cunstavál shall not proclaim any provincial constitution which has not been approved by a referendum in which at least either a majority of all citizens of the province or a two-thirds majority of votes actually cast is in favor of the constitution.

6. No person shall be at the same time Cunstavál of one province and the leader of the provincial government of another province.

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Miestră Schivă, UrN

The effective changes between this and the status quo:

1) all existing Cunstaváis are dismissed, though the King may reappoint any or all of them if he so wishes.
2) the King does not *have* to appoint a Cunstavál, in which case he exercises the royal powers directly in that province.
2) all further Cunstavál appointments are for a three year, renewable term.

PROTECT THE ORGLAW FROM POWER GRABS - NO POLITICISED KING! Vote THE FREE DEMOCRATS OF TALOSSA
¡LADINTSCHIÇETZ-VOI - rogetz-mhe cacsa!
"IS INACTIVITY BAD? I THINK NOT!" - Lord Hooligan

Baron Alexandreu Davinescu

I do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.
Alexandreu Davinescu, Baron Davinescu del Vilatx Freiric del Vilatx Freiric es Guaír del Sabor Talossan


Bitter struggles deform their participants in subtle, complicated ways. ― Zadie Smith
Revolution is an art that I pursue rather than a goal I expect to achieve. ― Robert Heinlein

Ian Plätschisch

Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 08:59:21 AMI do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.
This bill does not reduce any of the King's powers

xpb

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on October 05, 2023, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 08:59:21 AMI do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.
This bill does not reduce any of the King's powers

It would seem to reduce the King's powers to appoint a Cunstavál for any duration

Ian Plätschisch

Quote from: xpb on October 05, 2023, 04:57:20 PM
Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on October 05, 2023, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 08:59:21 AMI do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.
This bill does not reduce any of the King's powers

It would seem to reduce the King's powers to appoint a Cunstavál for any duration
There is no limit to the amount of times a Cunstaval could be reappointed.

If we are really concerned about overburdening the King by requiring reappointments once every three years, perhaps he should retire.

Miestră Schivă, UrN

If you really want to be technical, it *sets rules* for how the King enacts a particular power; but in contrast, it *gives the King an extra power*, i.e. the power to not appoint a Cunstaval at all and to exercise the royal power directly in one or more provinces. Which you could argue he already had but this makes it explicit.


PROTECT THE ORGLAW FROM POWER GRABS - NO POLITICISED KING! Vote THE FREE DEMOCRATS OF TALOSSA
¡LADINTSCHIÇETZ-VOI - rogetz-mhe cacsa!
"IS INACTIVITY BAD? I THINK NOT!" - Lord Hooligan

xpb

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on October 05, 2023, 05:12:46 PM
Quote from: xpb on October 05, 2023, 04:57:20 PM
Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on October 05, 2023, 03:59:31 PM
Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 08:59:21 AMI do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.
This bill does not reduce any of the King's powers

It would seem to reduce the King's powers to appoint a Cunstavál for any duration
There is no limit to the amount of times a Cunstaval could be reappointed.

If we are really concerned about overburdening the King by requiring reappointments once every three years, perhaps he should retire.

Your argument tries to deflect the actual core concept -- that the King (or Queen) has the power to appoint for a day or indefinitely, as they alone should see fit to do.

Miestră Schivă, UrN

And indefinite appointments lead to inactive Cunstavais. I know that some people think if John breaks wind loudly it should be praised as a brand new Top 40 hit single, but others don't think "The King Wills It" to be a good excuse for bad practice and the collapse of important constitutional offices.

PROTECT THE ORGLAW FROM POWER GRABS - NO POLITICISED KING! Vote THE FREE DEMOCRATS OF TALOSSA
¡LADINTSCHIÇETZ-VOI - rogetz-mhe cacsa!
"IS INACTIVITY BAD? I THINK NOT!" - Lord Hooligan

Bråneu Excelsio

If the limitations are set to the Cunstaval instead of the King's appointment, would that work too?
Fiován.

Baron Alexandreu Davinescu

Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on October 05, 2023, 08:04:42 PMAnd indefinite appointments lead to inactive Cunstavais. I know that some people think if John breaks wind loudly it should be praised as a brand new Top 40 hit single, but others don't think "The King Wills It" to be a good excuse for bad practice and the collapse of important constitutional offices.
Could we possibly discuss this without such rudeness?
Alexandreu Davinescu, Baron Davinescu del Vilatx Freiric del Vilatx Freiric es Guaír del Sabor Talossan


Bitter struggles deform their participants in subtle, complicated ways. ― Zadie Smith
Revolution is an art that I pursue rather than a goal I expect to achieve. ― Robert Heinlein

Ian Plätschisch

Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 09:13:24 PM
Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on October 05, 2023, 08:04:42 PMAnd indefinite appointments lead to inactive Cunstavais. I know that some people think if John breaks wind loudly it should be praised as a brand new Top 40 hit single, but others don't think "The King Wills It" to be a good excuse for bad practice and the collapse of important constitutional offices.
Could we possibly discuss this without such rudeness?
🙄

Baron Alexandreu Davinescu

Quote from: Ian Plätschisch on October 05, 2023, 09:17:45 PM
Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 09:13:24 PM
Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on October 05, 2023, 08:04:42 PMAnd indefinite appointments lead to inactive Cunstavais. I know that some people think if John breaks wind loudly it should be praised as a brand new Top 40 hit single, but others don't think "The King Wills It" to be a good excuse for bad practice and the collapse of important constitutional offices.
Could we possibly discuss this without such rudeness?
🙄
lol, I guess that's a no.
Alexandreu Davinescu, Baron Davinescu del Vilatx Freiric del Vilatx Freiric es Guaír del Sabor Talossan


Bitter struggles deform their participants in subtle, complicated ways. ― Zadie Smith
Revolution is an art that I pursue rather than a goal I expect to achieve. ― Robert Heinlein

xpb

I think we can just agree to disagree on this concept.

Sir Lüc

Quote from: Baron Alexandreu Davinescu on October 05, 2023, 08:59:21 AMI do not think it's a good idea to start the term by reducing the powers of the king.

I think you'd be welcome to privately suggest to John he should consider reviving Cunstavals on his own accord, much like you/he did with the Privy Council, in which case this bill would be entirely moot :)

(Of course, the important matter is that the Privy Council is only useful to him, while Cunstavals (should) perform important Organic functions in their own provinces.)
Sir Lüc da Schir, UrB
Directeur Sportif, Gordon Hiatus Support Team

In my free time:
Túischac'h dal Cosă / Speaker of the Cosa
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