Quote from: Aleksandr Belkin on May 21, 2022, 02:49:38 AM
Good afternoon! Yes, I would like to get a seat in the ward (translated by Google)

Ok, in that case i shall assign you 3 seats in the HoC for this term, welcome to chamber, and province :)

Hello, i would like to appoint the following deputies:-
Mic'haglh Autofíl
Antonio Montagnha
Vicocaput per Afáes Glheþeasacas: Miestră Schivă

Quote from: Aleksandr Belkin on May 18, 2022, 05:09:01 AM
I'm not sure if I'm in FreeDems, since I just recently became a citizen of Talossa! Translated to Google)

From internal party talks, i can confirm you are a member of the FreeDems, so if you would like seats in the House of Commons, then let me know, and i would be happy to share some of my seats (also, it might help to also read the constitution of the province, to see how things work here) Also, welcome to Ataturk :)

Quote from: Aleksandr Belkin on May 18, 2022, 04:41:10 AM
Good afternoon! I'm sorry for my questions! Can I vote for myself? Can I participate? (Translated by Google)

Hi, It is fine, you are free to ask questions, and despite forgetting to end it officially, the voting period had passed, so unfortunately you are too late to join in the elections this time. However, i believe you are a new member of the FreeDems? if so, i will be happy to share some of my seats in the chamber with you, so you can participate in this HoC term.

In response to the arguments about why the vote for Senechal by the cosa is needed, some of the arguments for this has already been made, but the main reason i believe it is needed, as it is a public declaration of endorsement of the new Seneschal, and in effect, whatever agreements made to put them in place. And until this vote confirms the Seneschal, things could still go awry in the intervening time until the vote. It is essentially a ratification of the incoming government, and its programme. It is more than just electing one person, it is formalising the government approach in the incoming cosa, and showing that they have the confidence of a majority of the Cosa, which until a vote is made, is uncertain, despite what might have been agreed beforehand.
So yeah, the importance is more that certain people believe in my view.

With proposals,

Quote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on May 02, 2022, 04:56:37 PM
My previous suggestion for a minimal tweak was simply deleting:

QuoteNo member of the Cosâ may abstain in the election of a Seneschál, and shall rank on his ballot at least two distinct preferences, which itself shall be made public.

But Açafat don't like that, so how about:

QuoteNo member of the Cosâ may abstain in the election of a Seneschál, and shall rank on his ballot at least two distinct preferences, which itself shall be made public. If there are two or fewer nominations for Seneschal, a single preference shall constitute a valid ballot.

But I prefer the first version. The question is: which can get 2/3 of the Cosa? Would TNC MCs like to express a preference? Because AD's "let the King pick the Seneschal, lol we know who he'll pick if it's at all ambiguous" is a no-go.

We might also consider language which would clear up any ambiguity about whether parties could make more than one nomination. I would err on the side of explicitly forbidding it.

deleting that part is a decent possibility, and likely a fairer way.
The second one is what is currently being proposed in the bill, i think.

I agree with more forbidding making more than one nomination by a party, except in limited circumstances, such as unexpected absence/ill tidings of the nominee, which is why im leaning to having the write in, but explicitly only as a way for a party to name a new nomination and have MC's vote for a new candidate, in this event, but otherwise write in's arent valid? (basically, have it as a failsafe to help prevent a one person election) this concept needs tweaking, but i think is workable. And i have been convinced by arguments here that a free choice write in is a bit unworkable in this case.

Quote from: Açafat del Val on May 01, 2022, 11:29:42 PM
I oppose any removal of the requirement. The issue is not requiring MCs to pick two preferences; it's MCs not having more than two choices for Seneschal.

This is a solution looking for a problem.

I Disagree, due to the nature of Talossa, these situations are likely not going to be a one off. And forcing an MC to vote, for a nominee, that goes against their political views, clashes with their freedoms, and is tyrannical in the approach, and the proposal, still keeps  ranked voting for above 3 in the vote.

QuoteQuote from: Miestră Schivă, UrN on Yesterday at 04:10:51 PM
I'm sympathetic to removing the compulsory preferencing aspect, but I'm not in favour of allowing "write-in votes". Cosa elections are between parties and individual MCs act as agents of those parties. Parties should continue to determine who the candidates for Seneschal are.

Also, with the write in, that i do feel the idea needs to be thought about more, as what happens if mid election, one of the candidates has to pull out, leaving one candidate, who they in good conscience would not vote for, i feel that having that option makes the system more democratic. And as is the system is too restrictions on MC's freedoms.

I am aware that we vote and govern with parties, and MC's as agents of those parties, so maybe there be a requirement that the party has to approve a write in first. I dont know, it is something that requires some thought.

But on the whole, this is an issue i feel strongly about, and respectfully, i have to massively disagree with Açafat del Val, who i feel is missing the point.

Thought id put my ideas for slight tweaks here.


Whereas, the recent Senechal elections have revealed a flaw,

Whereas, it is not fair on MC's to force them to vote for their opposition, in a two candidate race

Therefore, the following current text of law :-

QuoteThe method of election of a Seneschál shall be Ranked Choice Voting. Each member of the Cosâ shall have as many votes in the election as the seats which he hold in the Cosâ, but shall cast his votes as one bloc and have no divided conscience. The candidates for each such election shall be nominated by each political party which shall have earned representation in the Cosâ at the most recent general election. (54RZ23) (55RZ22)

No member of the Cosâ may abstain in the election of a Seneschál, and shall rank on his ballot at least two distinct preferences, which itself shall be made public. (54RZ23)

Shall be replaced by:-

QuoteThe method of election of a Seneschál shall be Ranked Choice Voting for 3 or more candidates, for 2, a straight majority vote of the Cosa will be required, limited to voting to one candidate only.. Each member of the Cosâ shall have as many votes in the election as the seats which they hold in the Cosâ, but shall cast their votes as one bloc and have no divided conscience. The candidates for each such election shall be nominated by each political party which shall have earned representation in the Cosâ at the most recent general election (54RZ23) (55RZ22)

No member of the Cosâ may abstain in the election of a Seneschál, and shall rank on their ballot at least two distinct preferences, which itself shall be made public. If the Cosa member wishes to, as a second or third preference, they shall be able to vote for any sitting Cosa member, as long as the First preference vote is for one of the named candidates in the election. (54RZ23)

Uréu q'estadra så
Antaglha Xhenerös Somelieir (MC - FreeDem)

I'm not sure the interpretation by the secretary of state is correct, as yes, organic law does say that political parties nominate candidates for the election, and that it is a ranked choice vote, but it doesn't say that MC's can ONLY vote for the candidates presented to the Cosa, it just says, that MC's votes must be ranked choice and vote for at least two candidates, but the law as written, doesn't explicitly state that the only choices for Seneschal are the ones presented by the parties, from what i understand from reading the said laws, Also, if i recall correctly, last time we had the elections of Seneschal, we weren't constrained purely by the choices from the parties.

But yeah, from what i can tell, as the law isnt specific enough, from my own reading there is enough leeway in the law to allow other votes to be cast. And

QuoteNo member of the Cosâ may abstain in the election of a Seneschál, and shall rank on his/her ballot at least two distinct preferences, which itself shall be made public. (54RZ23)

, doesn't specify that we have to vote only for the candidates presented, just that we need to make two distinct choices.

I will respect your decision, although i honestly find the thought of casting my second vote for the other candidate abhorrent and distasteful, in the matter, but i thought id point out these things, and share my thoughts (and explain why i thought as i did) with all anyway.

Also, to clarify for everyone voting (although im sure of the answer), an MC can vote for any sitting MC, it doesn't have to be the proposed candidates from what i can tell from the quotes of Org law? So can make a free choice outside the two candidates (like i have done in my second vote) named? (again, i think this is the case, just thought this would be good to confirm)

I hereby cast my vote for Ian Plätschisch as Seneschal for my first choice,
Which leaves my second vote, which i have changed, due to the SoS having a different view on the law,
So i am changing it out of respect for him.
My second choice vote is Brenier Tzaracompadra, which i cast under protest, but still cast.

Now voting is open, i vote for myself

As it has been beyond a week, nominations are now closed, and will be put to a vote before the house.
So i summon HoC members to the chamber to vote within the next two weeks, or until all members have voted
@Muhammed Yasir

I also support the nomination of Baron Alexandreu Davinescu as Tuischac'h

Thanks for assigning the seats so quickly

Now, we must nominate a Başbakan,
nominations shall be open for 1 week, then shall be put to a vote after.

I hereby nominate myself, to the position of Başbakan

Thank you, i assign 9 seats to myself and 3 seats to Aleksandr Belkin  (if any other FreeDems in the province wish to serve in the house, let me know and i will happily share some of the seats with you)

*amended to reflect seat assignment to a new member of the commons*